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Old 03-03-19   #31
Annie_Wong
 
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"because they are not part of the total package, do not possess the culture, heritage, beliefs, myths and all that supports the practices" > That's exactly what I think.

Your descriptions of the middle aged white women and young adults with anti-stance exhibiting activity in the craft today are what I see as well.
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Old 03-03-19   #32
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What is also interesting is that said priestess is performing whatever rituals she needs and gets paid for (death spells, love spells, binding spells and many more). I asked her if she is not fearing any consequences, but she is not believing in any threefold law saying if you don't believe in it nothing will happen to you. She has a very unique way of practicing the craft. She is worshipping her ancestors a lot and idolizes personal entities. She is strongly believing in herself as sort of a goddess respectively thinking of everybody as a god/goddess who needs to be activated/awakened. i would never dare to practice magic of that kind (honoring your ancestors seems a good thing to do to me though) and to that extent (spells harming others) but it's fascinating to learn about how different people's opinions on the craft are. Relating to Wicca for Wiccan's this has to be disastrous.

EDIT: This priestess practices Haitian Hoodoo mixed with own beliefs and family tradition and is a person of colour, just to get some facts straight.

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Old 03-03-19   #33
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I think you have to understand that the idea of the "Three fold law" is really not that universal. Many of the African Disapora type practices don't recognize it at all. The same applies to a lot of the ceremonial practices as well. Your more traditional witchcraft practices really do not adhere to it either as they would be just as quick to cast a curse as to try and heal you.

The thing that does intrigue me though is I don't know to many HooDoo or Santeria practitioners would call themselves priests or priestess. They have a similar term but it is not the same though. Doesn't have the same "religious" connections that priest / priestess implies as it does for Wicca.
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Old 03-04-19   #34
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You're right, the Three fold law does not apply to the craft as such. I find the African methods and views of witchcraft hugely interesting. Would you say the idea of a Three fold law is mainly a European based concept or is that much too sweeping a statement? With the aforementioned traditional witchcraft practices not considering it either I guess you cannot generalize.

Said priestess is actually calling herself High Priestess. I am not well versed in the terminology, but they have other words for it for certain. She does without animal sacrifices, but uses blood, bones (of already deceased creatures), churchyard mould and does a lot of candlework and using incense and flowers.

What is your personal opinion on any resulting consequences or a Three fold law. I know your view about black and white magic which is completely understandable and logical.
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Old 03-04-19   #35
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I'm just going to add my two cents, not addressing the bigger picture (I am sooo pressed for time) but wanted to add an experience, one that has decades of practise behind it but comes mostly from the heart.

I am a witch, a student of druidry and an animist. And I have a shrine to Oshun which has been a focal point of my practise, since 1990.


I am not black, I don't practise Santeria/Yoruba in any full sense, I keep a shrine to Brigid as well, and work with local spirits and ancestors, daily.

This shrine, this relationship with an Africa deity, is one of the richest and dearest of my entire life. People will smirk at me and dismiss the validity, and I don't actually care, because - yes, this is "UPG" - Oshun has been with me, has saved my ass in bad times, has gifted me with animal friends (I have three African species) and more. She basically gave me the house I live in. I have offered to Her daily, prayed to her and done rituals in Her tradition for 29 years. It may seem like silly eclectic cherry picking to some, but I met Oshun in the Occult Shop I worked in, I had to tend Her shrine as part of my duties there, and I developed an affinity for Her. Over the years, this affinity has deepened. And She has not been the capricious, jealous figure so often portrayed in popular culture AT ALL.



ALthough Oshun is not part of my own cultural heritage and I don't even practise properly from a Yoruban perspective, I feel this is a valid spiritual relationship, based on my reaching out in a genuine and consistently devoted way, and if it's cultural appropriation, which I hear about endlessly as a Western herbalist by profession, so be it.

Just sharing an experience that is not at all PC, but works for me.
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Old 03-04-19   #36
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This is one where you really have to decide how the person is defining the idea of the three fold law to be honest.

Many use the idea of what you send out comes back three times stronger and it's in a punishment mode. Which to me is idiotic to say the least. Yet other's use another version of the law which states that what is sent out can return in one of three ways. That one says it can come back physically, mentally or psychologically. Basically that one means for instance I do something that causes a potential harm it can come back by causing me psychological stress and worry about what I did, it can come back as mental anguish which is different than psychological influences or it can take an actual physical form such as jail, physical injury, retribution, etc. That or any combination of those. For instance I lets say curse someone, the curse causes them to suffer an injury which causes me to physically be placed in jail. Yet it also causes me to worry about what I did which causes me mental anguish asking myself if I did the right thing on a moral level which causes me psychological anguish because it impacts my own ethics and morality and makes me question my beliefs, morality, sense of moral justice which leads me to do something wrong which leads to me actually doing something which ends up getting me arrested.

So it never comes back three times stronger but it does impact me in three potential different ways. It becomes more a sense of true cause and effect and the idea of ripple effect and influences.

As practitioners we all think about cause and effect of our workings. The differences is the Three Fold Law as most seem to apply it assigns all fall out to a sense of ethical actions where true cause and effect does not rely upon ethics or morality. In my personal opinion those who follow it do so because it's an escape clause. It doesn't demand focus and attention to detail from them. They do not have to anticipate how things will unfold and spread out. Simply claim Three Fold Law and not do it less it come back upon them.

The components used in spellwork, rituals, ceremonies, etc are harder to discuss as those can vary from pathway to pathway and even how they are used within each. That doesn't even touch upon the notion that many "Tools" are mental enhancements that assist when people start out that others drop as they gain more experience.

It's blood usage. Did the person kill the animal themselves or did they go to the butcher to obtain it? Was the blood obtain via ritual slaughter or simply routine slaughter? Realistically was the blood simply gathered from the meat purchased from the store and pressed out or collected from the package? That doesn't even touch upon is it animal or Human? Is it menstrual? If Menstrual is it beginning cycle when light and liquid or ending cycle when chunky and thick? If it was self collected is it from the left arm or right arm which for some ties into dead blood or alive blood due to circulation and oxygen content.

Lots of things to consider and lots that are never discussed in the 101 books but were in inner court things or mystical aspects. Figure I was never a Wiccan but was initiated into things that were similar enough that had some interesting discussions.
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Old 03-04-19   #37
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If you read over what Fera wrote it's a perfect example of what I was saying earlier in the thread about when it comes to the divine or Spirits you can't say who they will choose for they themselves do not hold to any set "Racial" or "Ethical" standard of instance. They choose and utilize whomever they desire.
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Old 03-05-19   #38
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I think she works with her own blood a lot. Menstrual as well. Others are welcome to try out themselves for she is making videos of her performing her rituals showing what she is using beforehand, but I don’t know if that works too well if they don’t have that special connection and she is charging for services so she seems confident of her abilities. Maybe she uses blood from animals, but I don’t know the source, but remember how she told that her renouncing animal sacrifices as such made other witches question her. But her character/personality is too strong to get distracted by that. She just doesn’t care.

The choosing part is an intriguing subject, but I like how for feranja it worked out the way it did and it seems like an enormously precious connection. So the spirits will cooperate with you if they decide for you and that’s a wonderful thing. It’s like pushing boundaries others set for you. It seems very individual. Some people will claim they are chosen, but only being on the make or looking for fame, others simply ARE chosen. Thank you for your input feranja.
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Old 03-11-19   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie_Wong View Post
Thank you Sollie and DrumWolf!

@all: Something that really interests me is how did you find out about your personal orientation in the craft? Have you tried what works best for you or found out about it through literature etc and it instantly appealed to you? Because every single path seems so diverse and there are countless variations and possibilities. Or maybe you don't like to categorize yourself? Do most of you practice as solitaries? Maybe some non-Wiccans (certainly Wiccans as well!!) like to tell a bit about their experiences. Up to now my knowledge is mostly based on Wicca, that's why I'm asking.

@feranja: Thanks for sharing some details about your daily routine Sounds like a great way to welcome the day. I'd like to integrate some rituals in my everyday life as well and it would be great to have an altar/shrine. I live in a one-room apartment in a town so for me it is a rather tricky task to find a place to turn spiritual without any distraction (like beside my tv, my bed, my kitchen.) What do you think of portable altars? Generally I have access to nature for I am not living in a big city, but being outside is only pleasant in springtime, summer or maybe early fall. I definitely still need to find a special place where one can calm down.

I started my path when I was late in my teens. I was and still am a solitary witch. I started not really in a particular sect of Wicca. I eventually gravitated towards Celtic Wicca, then later onto Norse Wicca. Finally, after an incident when Lord Anubis helped me get over my fear of the darkness in the late 20s, I found my true path in Egyptian Wicca. I found such a deep connection with him that I just knew it. So ever since then I have been an Egyptian Wiccan.
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Old 03-11-19   #40
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Something I have to add here. Norse-Wicca, Egyptian-Wicca, Greek (Hellene)-Wicca, Peti-Wicca, Celtic-Wicca are all Wicca the addition of a pantheon preface only says what divinities and pantheon they are from that the practitioner worships. They do not change the Wiccan wheel or change the holidays or such.

Even with the Pantheon attachment it doesn't mean the practitioner worship's or recognizes all the divinities within that particular pantheon. Nor does it mean they actually worship in accordance to the methodology and mannerisms of the people or custom's of that particular culture or region.

It's like many who claim to be Celtic-Wiccan's would most likely be Irish Celtic influenced based upon the actual divinities they follow. The Irish Celtic history is the most commonly known and well published. The same could be said regarding many who claim "Celtic" as a people though it is actually a language group and not actually a people. Each group has a recognized tribal and / or regional name.
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