Go Back   EarthSong Forums > Spiritual and Religious Pathways > Native American Spirituality

Native American Spirituality Exploring Native American Spirituality, Magic and Mythology

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-18-18   #11
feranaja
 
feranaja's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Edge of the forest
Posts: 25,637

Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

Yeah, that "big show" thing is not cool. I kind of drip Celtic stuff, but that's my path and my heritage, so I don't have a problem with it. Invoking my Ojibwe great-grandmother so I can hang dreamcatchers from my ears - APPROPRIATION.
__________________
...deep peace of the running wave to you....

http://mallowandwhitepine.wordpress.com/
plants, spirit, medicine - my Earthwalker blog


"We're in a time of ethical and intellectual corruption. Study the spiritual traditions, live with excellence, resist insanity."
Thomas Moore
feranaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-18   #12
Flailing Idiot
Imbecile
 
Flailing Idiot's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,520

Reputation: 157
Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

I think it’s fine if your path, though what do I know?

I’m not sure I fully understand the line between appreciation and appropriation quite yet. I just shy away from the ones covered in healing crystals and pentagrams. Not that I, uh, ever wore a pentagram for uh show uh before when I was young. And, brainless.
__________________
certified master of flail
certified swiller of beer
certified certifiable

Last edited by Flailing Idiot; 05-18-18 at 09:30 PM.
Flailing Idiot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-18   #13
feranaja
 
feranaja's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Edge of the forest
Posts: 25,637

Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

I think there's an important difference between show-offy, and appropriation. If one genuinely is a (Satanist, Native American, Druid etc) then it's entirely up to that person how discreet they want to be. One of the most knowledgable and accomplished Druids I know personally, just wears a small triskele, often under his shirt. But I do know some others, who are very ...obviously druids. How much one dresses the part, or doesn't, is really (IMO) about personal style, not appropriation, as long as they are really what they claim to be.

It's when people take the outer trappings of another culture and claim it, things get a bit weird.

I have some really good articles on this somewhere, I'll try to find. I guess the NA issue bugs me more than the rest because, here we have a living tradition, a culture that has been almost destroyed by imperialism, and to add insult to injury, now we're all decked out in dreamcatchers etc. Just more shit we're stealing.If someone wants to pretend to be Druid, or Wiccan - I used to hang out with someone who wore a visible pentagram and tried to pose as a Witch without knowing the very core basics of Craft - well that's annoying. But, co-opting spiritual practises from a culture we obliterated strikes me as, well, kind of despicable.


Is that making sense?
__________________
...deep peace of the running wave to you....

http://mallowandwhitepine.wordpress.com/
plants, spirit, medicine - my Earthwalker blog


"We're in a time of ethical and intellectual corruption. Study the spiritual traditions, live with excellence, resist insanity."
Thomas Moore
feranaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-18   #14
Flailing Idiot
Imbecile
 
Flailing Idiot's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,520

Reputation: 157
Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

I would think the difference is important too. I think sometimes it may get murky I've heard reports of people giving yoga classes being accused of cultural appropriation, and I sometimes wonder what happened, why, and whether or not I have ever stepped over it. Interesting to talk about, or rather likely important to talk about it.

I hear you on the NA issue. I not long ago found out I have Blackfoot in my blood, it was more rumour some time ago, but Ive confirmed it since, though its more remote than I should be considering any real true significant link, but I'm interested it nonetheless.
__________________
certified master of flail
certified swiller of beer
certified certifiable
Flailing Idiot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-18   #15
feranaja
 
feranaja's Avatar

 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Edge of the forest
Posts: 25,637

Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

I believe that sometime people go overboard, to extremes, in an emotional response to a situation - declaring yoga off-limits seems like one of those cases,to me. I'm just mellow enough these days to feel that making changes is good, intention is powerful, but going hogwild with extremes (and then lording it over anyone who doesn't agree) does more harm than good.


Like with acknowledging Native blood(I have some too, as you know, a great grandmother) is not only good but respectful - turning that into "Look at me, I'm NA, whoo hooo" is not. Neither you nor I would do that, but believe me - I've known a few. Working for the government, owning their own home, living the whole White Privilege dream, and dying hair jet black, wearing a medicine Wheel and saying one is NA.
Because of a distant relative.
I find that really wrong.
__________________
...deep peace of the running wave to you....

http://mallowandwhitepine.wordpress.com/
plants, spirit, medicine - my Earthwalker blog


"We're in a time of ethical and intellectual corruption. Study the spiritual traditions, live with excellence, resist insanity."
Thomas Moore
feranaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-18   #16
MonSno_LeeDra
Shamanic Practitioner
 
MonSno_LeeDra's Avatar

 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 6,589

Reputation: 596
Default Re: Smudging - cultural appropriation or no?

Quote:
Originally Posted by feranaja View Post
I believe that sometime people go overboard, to extremes, in an emotional response to a situation - declaring yoga off-limits seems like one of those cases,to me. I'm just mellow enough these days to feel that making changes is good, intention is powerful, but going hogwild with extremes (and then lording it over anyone who doesn't agree) does more harm than good.
I do agree that people can and do go overboard. I also think people presume many times that other's are in the wrong simply because it goes against their position.

It's like my family lived in Japan (Nippon) for 6.5 years. My eldest son was actually born there. We lived off base so were more involved in the local culture and participated in many of the cultural norms due to that fact. Not all for certain and many were modified as we were not Japanese.

Yet we still practice some of those customs. Occasionally use chop sticks (Hashi) but don't leave them sticking in the rice as that is basically saying it's for the dead type thing.

But it was proper to learn the customs and such of where you lived and its people. Yet once learned you didn't just unlearn or forget its influence upon you. The people knew that and it was accepted and understood.

The people who tend to have issues with it are those who've never actually been or lived there beyond a short vacation, if that. There being whichever country they are claiming you've taken something from.

Quote:
Like with acknowledging Native blood(I have some too, as you know, a great grandmother) is not only good but respectful - turning that into "Look at me, I'm NA, whoo hooo" is not. Neither you nor I would do that, but believe me - I've known a few. Working for the government, owning their own home, living the whole White Privilege dream, and dying hair jet black, wearing a medicine Wheel and saying one is NA.
Because of a distant relative.
I find that really wrong.
I have a few cousins who have tried their hardest to "Prove" the required percentage of blood purity to get the benefits. Basically college grants, housing grants or other money type grants for having NA blood. No other reason behind their desires that I can find. Then supposedly getting upset I haven't been all fired up to assist them in their desire. I say supposedly for I haven't been told directly only hear say.

In the US it seems like nearly everyone has a family story of having NA blood. Yet a lot of it is from some ancestor that goes back in history and is passed down from generation to generation. Especially in the South where it's fairly common it seems. Ironically though, many are fabricated due to the NA resistance against western expansion and even earlier colonial arrival. That spirit was seen as a reflection of the struggle against the North and to a degree after the Civil War. So the same NA blood spirit that resisted then was calling for resisting again. I suppose it reappeared to some degree in a national mindset for WWI as I've seen some suggestions of a rise in NA blood ancestry at that time. Though the Dawes Rolls of 1889-1900 today are pretty much used to say one has native blood and a heritage of it that goes back and recognized by a number of nations and the federal government.
__________________
I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What or How You Understand!
MonSno_LeeDra is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Current time: 08:27 AM (GMT -4)


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2008 - 2016, EarthSong Forums. Most rights reserved.